Author Topic: Daily lesson  (Read 75971 times)

bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #50 on: August 07, 2013, 12:16:31 PM »
Smudge-It depends on the player. Heavier = slower. Slower putter speed and slower putter rotation. So what does your stroke require? Weight not only influences tempo, it really influences release point. A Puttlab and a little lead tape and the effect is obvious.



Taking advice form someone else based on what they do is dangerous. I have fit literally hundreds of putters in the past couple of years. I have not fit any two players the same.


One of the things I am most proud of as I go through this process is I have never used my own stroke as an example for one of my students to emulate. I listened to a young instructor the other day and the first words out of his mouth were, "This is how I do it." End of interview.


I think most players go too heavy to mask mechanical issues. Works a little but you have to ask, Is this as good as I could be?
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bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #51 on: August 07, 2013, 12:23:25 PM »
Isn't it the purpose of practice to develop "consistent mechanics". Grip, stance, ball position, stroke style, etc.
JC

JC It depends on how you practice. If you practice to achieve those things perfect. Most don't. they practice to make x number of putts in a row. Changing their technique with every miss. I use only one drill. It is the only one I use and many guys have mentioned it on the forum. Just roll the ball over a spot using different length strokes, and the same source of motion. Specific length strokes, with putter that fits so each set up is the same on every putt.
Bruce
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #52 on: August 07, 2013, 12:37:42 PM »
Lesson 34-Missed putts are easy to analyze. It is either speed or direction. When you judge the reason KNOW why dont ASSUME why.
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originalgaffputters

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #53 on: August 07, 2013, 01:33:11 PM »
Isn't it the purpose of practice to develop "consistent mechanics". Grip, stance, ball position, stroke style, etc.
JC

JC It depends on how you practice. If you practice to achieve those things perfect. Most don't. they practice to make x number of putts in a row. Changing their technique with every miss. I use only one drill. It is the only one I use and many guys have mentioned it on the forum. Just roll the ball over a spot using different length strokes, and the same source of motion. Specific length strokes, with putter that fits so each set up is the same on every putt.
Bruce You are dead on!! During practice and putting during a round I pick a spot one to two inches in front of my ball on my chosen target line.  My focus is on pace during the stroke.  Missed putts for me are usually speed related.  JC
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bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #54 on: August 08, 2013, 10:22:02 AM »
Lesson 35-Analyzing misses. NEVER FORGET the ball goes where the face is pointed. Path Direction has minor effect! Control face not path.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #55 on: August 09, 2013, 11:54:19 AM »
Lesson 36-Body alignment when putting is only important as it pertains to delivery of the putter at impact. Match alignment to your release.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #56 on: August 09, 2013, 05:24:20 PM »
Smudge-It depends on the player. Heavier = slower. Slower putter speed and slower putter rotation. So what does your stroke require? Weight not only influences tempo, it really influences release point. A Puttlab and a little lead tape and the effect is obvious.



Taking advice form someone else based on what they do is dangerous. I have fit literally hundreds of putters in the past couple of years. I have not fit any two players the same.


One of the things I am most proud of as I go through this process is I have never used my own stroke as an example for one of my students to emulate. I listened to a young instructor the other day and the first words out of his mouth were, "This is how I do it." End of interview.


I think most players go too heavy to mask mechanical issues. Works a little but you have to ask, Is this as good as I could be?

Bruce, I've gone lighter and shorter (338g @32-1/2"), using straight arms, low hands & eyes right over the ball, I'm a left eye dominant right hander, with a shoulder rock swing with a slight arc.  Seems unusal but, works well and feels great.  It gives me so much confidence but, I'm always amused by others telling me "that doesn't fit"  Your thoughts would be appreciated.

Regards
T
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #57 on: August 09, 2013, 06:38:59 PM »
Isn't it the purpose of practice to develop "consistent mechanics". Grip, stance, ball position, stroke style, etc.
JC

Check out Lesson 3 and Lesson 5. I would think people should be able to find THEIR own natural mechanics pretty fast if they follow 3 and 5 and have a fitted putter. Trying to "find" your mechanics can waste a lot of time. You already have mechanics... use that.
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bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #58 on: August 10, 2013, 08:13:13 AM »
Smudge-It depends on the player. Heavier = slower. Slower putter speed and slower putter rotation. So what does your stroke require? Weight not only influences tempo, it really influences release point. A Puttlab and a little lead tape and the effect is obvious.



Taking advice form someone else based on what they do is dangerous. I have fit literally hundreds of putters in the past couple of years. I have not fit any two players the same.


One of the things I am most proud of as I go through this process is I have never used my own stroke as an example for one of my students to emulate. I listened to a young instructor the other day and the first words out of his mouth were, "This is how I do it." End of interview.


I think most players go too heavy to mask mechanical issues. Works a little but you have to ask, Is this as good as I could be?

Bruce, I've gone lighter and shorter (338g @32-1/2"), using straight arms, low hands & eyes right over the ball, I'm a left eye dominant right hander, with a shoulder rock swing with a slight arc.  Seems unusal but, works well and feels great.  It gives me so much confidence but, I'm always amused by others telling me "that doesn't fit"  Your thoughts would be appreciated.

Regards
T

T.

Pretty common for left eye dominant players to be eyes directly over. So in my world if the posture is determined by vision, that is the place to start. It is also common for left eye dominant players to have a little right tilt or inside out to the stroke. I am not sure why but I have always thought it was the left eye - right hand combination that created the effect. Offset putter right? Helps square the face.

One piece of advice I can offer is if the release gets a little "blocky" soften your arms a little. Not bent just not locked. Locked arms reverses the rotation of the putter and the putter swings heel first through impact causing you to leave the face open.

FWIW I would say your putter is a perfect fit.

Bruce
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bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #59 on: August 10, 2013, 11:43:43 AM »
Lesson37-Match alignment to release? Closing the putter at impact? Set up closed. Hold the finish with the putter face up? Open your stance.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #60 on: August 10, 2013, 05:07:07 PM »
Thanks for that analysis Bruce & yes full shaft of offset both 3656 & 5036 whilst, its something you haven't touched on yet in your lessons, they are both naked of any alienment aids, smallest change with the biggest effect for me in a putter, I'll let you explain that one when you see fit.

Regards
T

BTW. Great lessons Bruce
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #61 on: August 11, 2013, 08:09:40 AM »
Lesson38-You don't putt with your feet. Position your feet to balance your stroke NOT to determine direction the ball will leave the putter.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #62 on: August 12, 2013, 11:28:10 AM »
Lesson39-Great putters control impact. Poor putters worry about aim/alignment. Best Lesson? Teach yourself the feel of square at impact.
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bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #63 on: August 13, 2013, 12:01:05 PM »
Lesson 40-Source of motion moves the hands. Hands control the putter. Controlling direction requires a knowledge of this relationship.
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bargolf

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #64 on: August 14, 2013, 10:02:20 AM »
Lesson41-Active or passive, the hands control the putter at impact=control direction ball leaves. #Consistent position to relative to path.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #65 on: August 15, 2013, 11:14:26 AM »
Lesson 42-Putting stroke will work better if the hands only have one job-position of the clubface. Never accelerate putter with your hands.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #66 on: August 16, 2013, 10:38:22 AM »
Lesson 43-Source of motion swing the hands and hands control where face is pointed. Source of motion controls speed!! Never hands.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #67 on: August 17, 2013, 10:27:31 AM »
Lesson 44-Key to speed control is the ability to make the proper length stroke, for the distance required, without changing rhythm or timing.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2013, 12:11:05 PM by bargolf »
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #68 on: August 18, 2013, 08:52:50 AM »
Lesson 45-Valuable knowledge-How long does it take from the start of your putting stroke until impact? Devices can measure this for you.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #69 on: August 19, 2013, 08:12:58 AM »
Lesson 46-Relate length of stroke to time. Practice. Count 1-2-3 at your natural pace. Start putter first and then count-Hit the ball on 3.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #70 on: August 20, 2013, 11:24:46 AM »
Lesson 47-Putter loft at impact influences ball speed off the putter, which determines how far the ball rolls. Focus on where more than how.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #71 on: August 21, 2013, 10:57:00 AM »
Lesson 48-Our research with Puttlab shows better players deloft ( forward shaft lean) the putter on longer putts. Less loft = more speed.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #72 on: August 21, 2013, 12:00:18 PM »
Lesson 48-Our research with Puttlab shows better players deloft ( forward shaft lean) the putter on longer putts. Less loft = more speed.

I was thinking about this recently. So is it OK to change loft/shaft lean for various conditions? For example the course top dressed the greens and they got a bit slower. I could use some more speed right now.

I was wondering if having a little deloft at impact was worth it -- Do I change my stroke slightly for a delofted impact and use the same amount of force as before or do I use my standard (vertical shaft) stroke and just hit it harder?
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #73 on: August 21, 2013, 12:02:14 PM »
Lesson 48-Our research with Puttlab shows better players deloft ( forward shaft lean) the putter on longer putts. Less loft = more speed.


I was thinking about this recently. So is it OK to change loft/shaft lean for various conditions? For example the course top dressed the greens and they got a bit slower. I could use some more speed right now.

I was wondering if having a little deloft at impact was worth it -- Do I change my stroke slightly for a delofted impact and use the same amount of force as before or do I use my standard (vertical shaft) stroke and just hit it harder?
 ...knowing that in a few days I'll go back to standard force and shaft lean.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #74 on: August 21, 2013, 03:57:19 PM »
Ryan
The deloft is a way to create more ball speed without a cooresponding increase in club speed. As to what's best? That is a decision of the player.
Bruce
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #75 on: August 22, 2013, 09:04:23 AM »
Ryan, I'm a big fan of the forward press on account of using my eyes to judge distance whilst pratise swinging and therefore, length of stroke, trying add a percentage more "because they're a bit slow" is rather a hit and miss. :-[

Regards
T
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #76 on: August 22, 2013, 11:21:44 AM »
T,

Do you use less forward press when greens are faster?
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #77 on: August 22, 2013, 11:40:13 AM »
NO!!!!!!!! See Lesson 50 :)

« Last Edit: August 22, 2013, 11:45:33 AM by bargolf »
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #78 on: August 22, 2013, 11:40:20 AM »
Lesson 49-Better to control loft of putter at impact than force acceleration looking for correct speed. Forced strokes = random results.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2013, 11:44:51 AM by bargolf »
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #79 on: August 22, 2013, 11:52:29 AM »
My normal address is vertical (full shaft of off-set on my putters & only 3 degrees of loft in addition, I'm left eye dominant so I'm right over the ball), I only forward press when there is something obvious (usually visual) slowing the greens down, could be water (dew or rainfall), top dressing, shaggy turf ect. but, the forward press is visual & measurable.

My normal address has the butt of the grip in line with my flies (trouser zipper) therefore, when greens are very slow or I can see something which will slow them down on the practise green I go a butt's width forward and then use the same length of putter stroke for the distance I see.  Sometimes its a single butt width forward possible two, if its three I'm back in the pro-shop asking for my money back unless its a comp.

All of my set-up is visual, I'm not square to the path, I'm no SBST, I putt with my arms fully extended and my eyes are directly over the ball at address but and its a big BUT, I start the ball consistantly on its intended path with my natural stroke and thats all I want.  True the intended path ain't always the one to the hole but, thats golf for ya.  I hope that explaination helps.

Regards
T
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #80 on: August 22, 2013, 12:48:23 PM »
NO!!!!!!!! See Lesson 50 :)

Bruce, 

are you saying No - Don't use less forward press for faster greens per my previous question?

...but in lesson 49 you are saying it's easier to control loft at impact than force acceleration?



T,

I'm trying something much like what you stated, but I literally just starting experimenting with it. A very small (one butt's worth) of press for slower greens.

...but the greens are getting faster again, so I may just leave it alone for now.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #81 on: August 22, 2013, 04:10:46 PM »
Right, Deloft would have the ball come off faster. Is that what we want for faster greens?

Ryan. find a length backswing you can repeat. Without any change (especially hands relative to body) except how you lean, hits some putts with the same length backswing. Start with your weight on your left foot, then centered, then right foot. Make sure you hands remain in the same spot relative to something like your belt buckle and you use the same length backswing and same tempo.

You will be amazed in the difference in the distance the ball rolls. I am going to catch hell for giving this one out. :)
« Last Edit: August 22, 2013, 04:12:23 PM by bargolf »
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #82 on: August 23, 2013, 11:19:54 AM »
Lesson 51 - When you understand and use a single source of motion consistently, you are better prepared to adapt to changing conditions.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #83 on: August 23, 2013, 11:22:33 AM »
Lesson 50-Better to tilt posture than move hands to control loft at impact. Weight on Back foot = More loft. Front foot = Less loft.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #84 on: August 23, 2013, 01:15:05 PM »
Right, Deloft would have the ball come off faster. Is that what we want for faster greens?

Ryan. find a length backswing you can repeat. Without any change (especially hands relative to body) except how you lean, hits some putts with the same length backswing. Start with your weight on your left foot, then centered, then right foot. Make sure you hands remain in the same spot relative to something like your belt buckle and you use the same length backswing and same tempo.

You will be amazed in the difference in the distance the ball rolls. I am going to catch hell for giving this one out. :)

That's interesting. -more of a weight shift.
Would you adjust once for the entire round or could you adjust per stroke if more speed is needed for an uphill roll then adjust back for a downhill roll?
www.byronputters.com

ryan@byronputters.com

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #85 on: August 23, 2013, 03:01:42 PM »
I learned this from a tour player. He would work the ball on a putt just like any othe rshot. Lean into a slow putt lean back on a fast one. Lean back on a short putt so he could be a little more aggressive with his stroke without zooming it past.

To answer your question Ryan. Try it out and use it as or if it helps you.

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #86 on: August 23, 2013, 06:40:58 PM »
Weight transfer, interesting Bruce, I'll try it out when I get back from vacation.

Regards
T

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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #87 on: August 24, 2013, 08:45:08 AM »
This particular player used equal weight distribution to start. If you are already weight forward then all you can do is slow it down.



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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #88 on: August 24, 2013, 12:11:05 PM »
Lesson 52- You can't change how a ball rolls! You can influence when and where it starts to roll, but that is all the influence you have.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #89 on: August 25, 2013, 07:42:43 AM »
Lesson53-Once a ball begins to roll, where it goes is out of your control! Gravity and friction take over. You control the start not finish.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 09:42:23 AM by bargolf »
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #90 on: August 26, 2013, 11:28:37 AM »
Lesson 54-Focus your efforts on hitting the ball in the middle of the clubface.  Path direction is only an issue with off center strikes!
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #91 on: August 27, 2013, 10:17:09 AM »
Lesson 55-The desired result of a consistent path is to hit the ball on a consistent point on the clubface. Not to control direction!
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #92 on: August 28, 2013, 08:30:36 AM »
Lesson56-Maintaining a consistent club position to the path means a consistent hand position to the path-not the target line-common mistake.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #93 on: August 30, 2013, 09:51:32 AM »
Lesson 57- Path shape of the putter swing is a delivery system to impact. Big Arc or No Arc,There is no best way! Best? Your natural stroke.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #94 on: August 31, 2013, 10:55:43 AM »
Lesson 58-Most putting problems come when we try to match a method that doesn't suit our tendencies. Don't always fight what seems natural.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #95 on: September 01, 2013, 09:32:10 AM »
Lesson 59-Review-Stroke mechanics-Eyes tell you where to stand. Fit putter to that set up. Identify a source of motion, use it consistently.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #96 on: September 02, 2013, 09:57:31 AM »
Lesson 60-Target location and set up is a visual process. The stroke is a mechanical process. You can't aim a moving object-swing not steer
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #97 on: September 03, 2013, 11:03:51 AM »
Lesson 61-We react to what we see, but it takes 200ms to process. Average forward swing to impact takes 350ms. Can't fix a stroke in motion.
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #98 on: September 03, 2013, 03:43:49 PM »
Oh I like 60 & 61 a lot, "Train it, then Trust it" works for me.

Great stuff Bruce.

Regards
T
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Re: Daily lesson
« Reply #99 on: September 03, 2013, 04:17:54 PM »
Thanks T.
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